Jan. 28, 2025
Does My Revocable Living Trust Need a New Tax ID Number? (Episode 312)
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Well, good afternoon everyone, all you Michiganders out there in
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this cold, cold winter weather. Today is Tuesday, January twenty eight,
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twenty twenty five, and of course this is Tuesday with Tom,
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Michigan's only weekly Internet show where we answer your questions
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about a state planning and a state settlement in Michigan.
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I'm your host, Tom Doyle, a state planning attorney, lifelong
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Michigan resident, an ambassador for all things good in this
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wonderful winter land called Michigan. Welcome to today's program. Well,
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I took a little time off over the holidays. I
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figure we're at the end of January, so we should
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start up with some new episodes. If you had been
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listening recently, you would know that the last episode was
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does Santa have to pay Gift Taxes? So I had
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a discussion during the last episode about gift taxes and
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gift tax obligations. So if you've got questions about gift taxes,
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I would encourage you to listen to last week's episode. Today,
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based upon conversations that had with clients recently, today's question
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is does my revocable living trust need a new tax
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ID number? But please remember what I'm about to discus
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us is as always for educational purposes only. It is
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not intended to be legal advice. You need to work
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with your attorney and your tax advisor to determine what
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is appropriate for you and your state plan. So does
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my revocable living trust need a new tax ID number? Well,
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let's just start with some basic concepts. Revocable living trust.
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We're not talking irrevocable. Irrevocable is one that can never
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be changed. Revocable is one that can be changed. And
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it's the most common trust that people have as part
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of their estate plan. So it's think of it as
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a legal entity, or I always tell clients think of
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it as a box, and that you're putting assets inside
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the box, and the box is going to hold those
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assets during your lifetime and after your death, those assets
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are going to be distributed. Now, while you're alive, you
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are full control of the revocable trust, and because it's
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a revocable trust, you can change it. You can change
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the beneficiaries, you can change the trustee, you can get
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rid of the trust if you want to, and you
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can put assets into the box. You can take assets
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out of the box. Now, if you listen to previous
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episodes of Tuesday with Tom or attended one of our seminers.
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You would also know normally people will look having a
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living trust one because they want to control the distribution
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of their state after they die, and or it could
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be multiple reasons. They want to avoid probate and or
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they want to maintain privacy of their estate. And if
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you have any questions about any of those, go on
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head on over to Tuesday with Tom and you can
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search for any of those topics and it will bring
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up a list of previous episodes where I've talked about
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all of those. But now let's talk about tax purposes
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during your lifetime. The IRS reviews your revocable living trust
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as what they call a grant or trust, and what
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that means is that any income and expenses of the
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trust are simply reported under your Social Security number. So
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if the income and expenses are going to be reported
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under your social Security number, there is no need to
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get a separate tax ID number for your trust. In fact,
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if you went online and applied for a separate tax
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ID number, many people will make a mistake in that
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application and perhaps have the IRS wanting all kinds of
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tax returns filed that aren't necessary. So again the IRS
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is not going to require you to have a separate
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tax ID number. They are going to be satisfied if
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income and expenses are reported under your your so Security.
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The same thing's going to happen with tax returns. You're
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going to file your regular income tax returns using your
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Social Security number, so makes it easier for you. Now
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what happens, oh, when you die, Well, when you die,
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now the trust becomes irrevocable. That means it can't be changed.
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And once it can't be changed, now the IRS is
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going to look at it as being a separate taxable entity.
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And once it becomes a separate taxable entity, that would
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be at the time of your death. Now it needs
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to have a new tax ID number, So during your lifetime,
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no new tax ID number. Upon your death, new tax
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ID number. Let's say though, that you are married and
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you have a joint trust. One of you dies, the
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surviving spouse can continue to use his or her Social
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Security number, so it's not going to become irrevocable until
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the death of both spouses, and that is the time
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that a new tax ID number would have to be obtained. Again,
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during your lifetime. Because it's a revocable living trust, there
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is no need to obtain a new tax ID number.
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So the question or the answer to the question, does
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my revocable living trust need a new tax ID number?
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Short answer is during your lifetime no, after your death, yes,
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of course. If you have any questions about that, feel
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free to contact our office and we would be happy
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to assist you in having an understanding of that, or
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you can certainly contact your CPA or other tax advisor
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who ought to be able to explain that as well.
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And always too the a reminder that Amanda and I
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would be honored to have the opportunity to help you
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protect your loved ones by putting together your estate plan,
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amending a current plan, or assisting you in settling in
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a state. We now have recently, as of last week,
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moved we're headquarters here in Grand Rapids to downtown in
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the heart of the government business district. So if you
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happen to be in Grand Rapids, we would be happy
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to have a consultation with you at our new downtown
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Grand Rapids location. We are also in the process of moving,
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hopefully if fingers crossed our Lancing location back to where
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it had been for very many many years on West
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Saint Joe Highway in the township. Fingers crossed that if
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everything comes together, that is going to be happening very
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soon where the place that you likely saw us in
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Lancing is going to be returning to the West Saint
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Joe office. We have a meeting on Monday to be
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talking to the landlord about making that happen. Of course,
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we also have our virtual consultation that would be either
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by zoom or telephone. All of that can be taken
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care of. Scheduling an appointment in person or scheduling virtual
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consultation Zoom or telephone can all be done by visiting
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Doyle LAWPC dot com, where you will find information about
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how to get those scheduled, or you can always call
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the office at five one seven three two three seven
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three six six Remember two. If all you're looking for
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is a particular individual document, maybe you're simply looking at
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needing a new certificate of trust, or maybe you're looking
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at I just need a new durable power of attorney,
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I invite you visit our legal store again at Doyle
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LAWPC dot com. There you're going to find information on
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how you can order just individual documents. Through the website,
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you can make arrangements to pay for those documents that
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are going to be ordered, and those documents, if they're appropriate,
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will be prepared for you by us and emailed to
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you so that you can print them off and have
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them executed again. That would be the legal store at
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Doyle LAWPC dot com. Well, it's called outside and I
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think that is going to be it for today's program.
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As always, ooh, if you have a question about the program,
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or a comment about the program, or a topic that
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you'd like to have me discuss, because many of the
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episodes you will find that a cover based upon questions
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that we've been asked or conversations that we've had. Head
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on over to Tuesday with Tom dot com. That's the
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website for Tuesday with Tom. There you're going to find
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a microphone. Click on the micro and you can leave
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a message asking your question or asking indicating a topic
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that you delict to have us discuss. Obviously, if it's
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a personal consultation type question, we're not going to answer
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that question over the air, or you can always send
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me an email. That would be Tom at Tuesday with
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Tom dot com. We also invite you staying current with
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what we are doing and other things that are happening
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matter of fact, updating you on different things that are
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going on with the state planning or topics that we
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think might be of interest to our readers. So simply
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you can always ask your smart speaker to play Tuesday
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with Tom. Thanks again, though for spending some of your
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time with us today. As always, I hope that you
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have an awesome day and an awesome week in Michigan.
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Stay safe. Tuesday with Tom has been brought to you
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by the estate planning attorneys at Doyle Law PC. To
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learn how we can help you with your estate plan
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or with settling a loved one's estate, please call us
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today at five one seven three two three seven three
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sixty six. That's five one seven three two three seven
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three sixty six.
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00:08:15.399 --> 00:08:19.079
102
00:08:19.360 --> 00:08:23.800
103
00:08:24.160 --> 00:08:30.120
104
00:08:30.160 --> 00:08:33.080
105
00:08:33.159 --> 00:08:37.399
106
00:08:37.440 --> 00:08:41.200
107
00:08:41.279 --> 00:08:46.639
108
00:08:46.879 --> 00:08:50.720
109
00:08:50.840 --> 00:08:53.879
110
00:08:54.000 --> 00:08:57.799
111
00:08:58.039 --> 00:09:01.039
112
00:09:01.080 --> 00:09:06.000
113
00:09:06.080 --> 00:09:10.120
114
00:09:10.159 --> 00:09:14.360
115
00:09:14.399 --> 00:09:18.639
116
00:09:18.799 --> 00:09:22.320
117
00:09:22.399 --> 00:09:25.759
118
00:09:25.879 --> 00:09:30.159
119
00:09:30.519 --> 00:09:35.840
120
00:09:36.039 --> 00:09:39.519
121
00:09:39.600 --> 00:09:42.240
122
00:09:42.639 --> 00:09:46.159
123
00:09:46.200 --> 00:09:49.559
124
00:09:49.600 --> 00:09:54.200
125
00:09:55.320 --> 00:09:58.240
126
00:09:58.320 --> 00:10:02.120
127
00:10:02.279 --> 00:10:06.360
128
00:10:06.600 --> 00:10:09.279
129
00:10:09.440 --> 00:10:13.159
130
00:10:13.480 --> 00:10:30.639
131
00:10:30.679 --> 00:10:34.799
132
00:10:34.879 --> 00:10:38.600
133
00:10:39.519 --> 00:10:42.600
134
00:10:42.679 --> 00:10:44.799
135
00:10:44.840 --> 00:10:48.639
136
00:10:48.639 --> 00:10:52.600
137
00:10:52.600 --> 00:10:55.159
138
00:10:55.200 --> 00:10:58.279
139
00:10:58.279 --> 00:11:01.080
140
00:11:01.080 --> 00:11:05.720
141
00:11:05.759 --> 00:11:09.200
142
00:11:09.240 --> 00:11:13.360
143
00:11:13.440 --> 00:11:18.080
144
00:11:18.080 --> 00:11:20.559
145
00:11:20.679 --> 00:11:25.000
146
00:11:25.039 --> 00:11:28.080
147
00:11:28.080 --> 00:11:30.720
148
00:11:30.799 --> 00:11:33.919
149
00:11:33.919 --> 00:11:38.120
150
00:11:38.200 --> 00:11:41.159
151
00:11:41.240 --> 00:11:44.720
152
00:11:44.759 --> 00:11:47.720
153
00:11:47.720 --> 00:11:51.200
154
00:11:51.200 --> 00:11:54.039
155
00:11:54.120 --> 00:11:59.919
156
00:12:00.039 --> 00:12:02.399
157
00:12:02.519 --> 00:12:06.240
158
00:12:06.360 --> 00:12:10.519
159
00:12:11.480 --> 00:12:15.759
160
00:12:15.799 --> 00:12:19.000
161
00:12:19.039 --> 00:12:24.919
162
00:12:25.000 --> 00:12:30.320
163
00:12:31.120 --> 00:12:35.600
164
00:12:36.039 --> 00:12:39.720
165
00:12:39.759 --> 00:12:42.600
166
00:12:42.759 --> 00:12:45.240
167
00:12:45.279 --> 00:12:49.759
168
00:12:49.799 --> 00:12:53.519
169
00:12:53.799 --> 00:12:58.759
170
00:12:58.960 --> 00:13:02.440
171
00:13:02.480 --> 00:13:05.720
172
00:13:05.720 --> 00:13:09.120
173
00:13:09.200 --> 00:13:14.519
174
00:13:15.320 --> 00:13:21.399
175
00:13:21.440 --> 00:13:25.480
176
00:13:25.600 --> 00:13:27.799
177
00:13:28.159 --> 00:13:31.320
178
00:13:31.320 --> 00:13:34.320
179
00:13:34.440 --> 00:13:37.840
180
00:13:37.960 --> 00:13:38.879
